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+---- Thread: High end gear to aim for? (/showthread.php?tid=59065)
High end gear to aim for? - zeanomourph - 04-02-2017
I'm a veteran from back in the day, I think I started playing at version 0.0.15 or something crazy like that, but haven't played in literal years now.
Looks like heeeeaps of new stuff has been added, and my ex-top-tier loadout needs a bit of updating.
Lvl 52 Commando getting around with:
Morningstar
Swadian Kite Shield
Butcher (I have a Flamberge somewhere I think I lent it to a friend)
Barricade
Great Helm
Striped Armour
Ornate Hourglass Gauntlets
Highlander Boots
Only got about 100k gold so will need to save for a while, but just looking for some advice on what I should be aiming towards and what I should focus on upgrading first.
Also noticed there is now a Tier 5, but I've forgotten how to get Class Points because I was at maximum tier for so long before I stopped playing... I have 3 but how do I get more to level up to tier 5, and should that be my focus before upgrading equipment?
Mucho Thanko.
RE: High end gear to aim for? - LordChaos - 04-02-2017
Hello,
Well erm. As a commando, depending on which t5 you are looking for, it will be completely to build your character around.
You need to level up to achieve the T5 (But you are t the max), then to unlock it you'll need to pay 750 000 gold. Anyway you have 3 options then:
1) Shielder (Royal Guard)
2) Slasher/DPS(ZweiHander)
3) Throwing hero (legio)
All 3 are good options, Seeing what you currently have I guess you would be fit to slash currently more than anyhing else I guess (Flamberge/Butcher). You can slash as any of the three heroes, Zweihanders just have the upper hand in the DPS long term of course.
1) Now you could get to the shielder hero, you'll need a better shield as a priority and eventually better armor. Better armor because you will be hit as being a shielder,it's almost impossible not to be hit. Between the crushthrough, the ballistas, the explosives etc.. There are so many things that will get through your shield and harm you. And actually you can also trade health for a hit or two on a bot. Tanking a bot with your health meanwhile you take care of an aggro for example. Which means : If you take the RG option, you will have to get a better shield, there are some really good ones, very underrated that are pretty cheap such as:
400-600k ish : Teutonic shields or defender shield. I wouldn't advise the defender shield and it's a long story to explain, but the 2 other teutonic ones are better stat wise even if it's the same crafting. (P/RG)
1m-1.5m: Swadian Studded Shield, which is very close the the Royal Shield and way better than the previous ones. ©
1.8m-2.2 : Royal shield, which is very decent ©
The next are the high end tier:
2.5mish : SSSS, SDKS, Swadian resilience. There a lot of different opinions as for these, for me I would prefer the SSSS over the resilience, but that's a personnal choice. But the most balanced of these 3 is the SDKS (Small dragon kite shield), which has the best stats of all 3 if you had to compare them. Don't listen to people telling you that a shield is "too small", unless you're shielding with a highlander shield, you don't actually have issues. It might be for the ones behind you though, and it's their own responsability not to be shot behind you. As for the leg shots, you will still be shot in the legs whatever the size of the shield, that's why you need good armor. (C+)
2.5mish too: Aegis (which is the best option and craft for shielders) (P/RG)
As for the meaning of the letters : P = Pavise, C+ = commando hero, R= Royal Guard, C = Commando. The prices are based on the current crafting prices and the current selling prices ranges.
Shielders are almost always welcome to any run.
2) Slasher: AKA Zweihanders
That's a very interresting option as your shielders depends on you a lot, you could even slash without a shielder and just barricades. But the current """"meta"""""" doesn't really give a chance to Zweis saddly.
People tend to exploit AI behaviour to throw stuff at the bots and stay away from the cades, trying to avoid the cades being hit (generally), which isn't very fun anymore for zweis I believe. I don't have a Zwei, and won't probably make one, but I would let someone else speak for that hero, as I don't know it well. In the pros: You'll earn good money if you kill stuff. I wouldn't say that Zwei are welcome to any run unless there are shielders and they won't have any fun if there is nothing to do.. But here your priority will be : 1) Get a good slashing weapon or decent one such as a hammer/maul or something else. 2) Get some head and body armor (you have an extra exclusive cheap helmet in the marketplace) 3) Eventually get a shield "incase" but it's no priority. ** Will definetly need someone to argue over this and maybe give more pros or something, idk.
3) Legio:
Legio is a very good class, but it's a bit more of the "lonewolf" of the commandos. It doesn't necessarly require teamwork to achieve anything. If your armor is light enough you can easily kite runs having a better armor than a pikeman, less damage in the throwing generally, the aim is a bit worse, but it's doable. It can be a pro to some people of course, but that's just personnal opinion once again. Good thing : people don't generally mind legios in runs I believe, they can be replacer shielders, replacer slashers and can always have usability to kill stuff by throwing.
In the cons : if you want to play legio, you'll need to invest a lot of money in your equipement. You need to think of the fact that your weight matters more than if you are a shielder, that you need damage, and that you need a good throwable weapon. I would advice CTS/Pilums as a starter throwable weapon, have also a decent 1 handed get a decent armor aswell. Then the shield doesn't really matter that much like the zwei.
For all three heroes, a good starter armor is the first trans which is around 1.5m generally. Some people give different prices for the different colours, but it doesn't matter, the armor is the same.
+ Updated.
RE: High end gear to aim for? - Bobo - 04-02-2017
Welcome back man, it's always nice to see ppl returning, especially after such a long long time.
Really top tier reply from LordChaos above, not much to add.
1. LordChaos uses expressions " to be welcome to a run". For someone who's been afg for a long time that might suggest he wouldn't be welcome if he's not a particular class or doesn't own some particular gear. That is not the case, a players is always welcome to play, except when suspected of trolling if joining a ragarok run with low tier armour that makes him just too easy to kill and therefore it is not sure if his intention is to play and help the team or just to disrupt the run.
I believe the intention for the expression was to point out which class or gear is more helpful in the run taking into consideration the tactics that are currently common (like cadeing off with walls and dealing ranged damage which leaves little room for Zweis for anything else than just standing and watching or going out and dying quickly in the crowd of enemies).
2. as for the shield that are RG only usable: it is the obvious choice if you'd become RG, however take a minute to think if you are not planning to make another commando class, too. In such a case a shield that is T4 usable is a money saver as you can use one across your chars. Aegis is the best balanced option for RG, while I 'd support the choice of the Small Dragon Kite Shield (SDKS) for T4 from my own experience.
3. take into consideration that the mid-tier gear options like e.g. Teutonic Shield will only serve you until you can afford a better one and they might be pretty difficult to sell later
4. as for commando heroes classes: myself I have only Legio and I'm happy with. It is a very nice overall class that can take on different roles in the run and can always be helpful for the team, no matter the tactics. I'd just add here that a decent shield is a must for Legio, as you may need to shield for the team if there's no RG, the cades gap proves too wide or the RG gets killed. It is true Legio is expensive to gear up since this class does a lot of different things in the run so at the same time it must be geared up for ranged damage, shielding and engaging enemies in close quaters, just like LordChaos says.
5. do not worry your current gear is not up to the task, on a populated server there are usually ppl who bring a decent gear you can use, except the armour that you need to bring on your own.
6. very helpful though a bit outdated: http://forum.nordinvasion.com/showthread.php?tid=17198
RE: High end gear to aim for? - Kriegstofu - 04-02-2017
(04-02-2017, 02:12 AM)LordChaos Wrote: the explosives etc.. There are so many things that will get through your shield and harm you. And actually you can also trade health for a hit or two on a bot.
+ Updated.
wait does that mean that a better armor protects against thors/siegemasters fire?
and what do you mean by trading health? do RGs get a bit of Health when killing a bot?
RE: High end gear to aim for? - LordChaos - 04-02-2017
(04-02-2017, 06:24 PM)Kriegstofu Wrote:(04-02-2017, 02:12 AM)LordChaos Wrote: the explosives etc.. There are so many things that will get through your shield and harm you. And actually you can also trade health for a hit or two on a bot.
+ Updated.
wait does that mean that a better armor protects against thors/siegemasters fire?
and what do you mean by trading health? do RGs get a bit of Health when killing a bot?
I believe the fire is raw (true) damage, but it depends of your ironflesh if you want to speak of total % as we have more HP.. (obviously). Same for Thor, but I was speaking about the fact of receiving damage through shield, when being directly being hit at
. As for trading for health, no you don't get HP when you kill a bot, but imagine that you are taking an aggro of 5-6, one of them is hitting you, you don't deal with it because he is behind you and you expect the ranged to deal with it or a slasher. Saddly, it doesn't happen often, which could get you killed. Yup, sad story. So the fact of taking a couple of hits for the "greater" good can happen often, such as fighting a wraith, sometimes you can't fight it back, and that also does depends of your armor. Unless it does only overhead then you're screwed lol. There are so many types of examples. Armor is essential for RG and weight isn't relevant. But attack speed does I believe at least for RG.
The other classes are clearly "weight dependent" on the contrary and it is hard to afford with not that much money. (Zwei & Legio). -> For the output damage.
RE: High end gear to aim for? - Bobo - 04-02-2017
(04-02-2017, 02:12 AM)LordChaos Wrote: (...) And actually you can also trade health for a hit or two on a bot. (...)
(04-02-2017, 06:24 PM)Kriegstofu Wrote: (...) and what do you mean by trading health? do RGs get a bit of Health when killing a bot?I understood the above that if you are strongly armoured you can afford the risk of getting hit if you engage agresively. The stronger the armour the more you can risk to get hit without being killled.