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+---- Thread: Remove AI cavarly (/showthread.php?tid=665)
Remove AI cavarly - ComradeTemuzu - 09-01-2012
"WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU MAD?!"
Yes. And no. Youre propably wondering why the hell would I want to remove AI cavarly. Well, there are a few good reasons, and Ill list them right away.
AI Cavarly:
Pros
- Offers a challenge
- ...Gives bonemeal?
Cons
- AI cavarly is not exactly intelligent. They get stuck in corners, fences, apples, bodies, you name it. The advantage the horses give to them is also extremely easy to neutralize, by simply going to a place cavarly can not reach. This cant be fixed with any amount of map changes, there simply are places that horses can not get to, such as indoor locations, walls, roofs, and so on, unlike their dismounted companions.
- AI cavarly does not do its job. Just like I just said, any advantages cavarly might have can and will be easily neutralized by the players. And even if that is not the case, they still fail to fulfill one of their most important roles: Counter player cavarly. Usually, players are very fast compared to the AI, and therefore can simply make the AI follow them in a line while they stab/shoot them.
- Nords do not use horses. I repeat, NORDS. DO. NOT. USE. HORSES. Thats one of the things that define Nords, theyre a pure infantry faction. Certainly a few chosen lords use horses to show their dominance over their subjects, but there sure as hell are no "Nord Knights", or "Nord Cavarly", and considering that the makers of the mod are so strict on the theme I was astounded when I first encountered cavarly. I understand the reasoning, but I think my reasons are just as good to remove them.
- Scene making is harder. With cavarly in the mod, and the absolute requirement to make every place accessible to cavarly, many, many maps that show potential can not be accepted in the mod simply because theyre not cavarly friendly. For example I would show the siege map found on the map section, not to mention my new map which still needs fixing because ride their damn ponies up a small bridge.
Got that? Lets recap:
Cavarly gets stuck in places due to the bad riding AI which also makes them easy to defeat by using environment, maps are harder to make when we have to think of the cavarly getting into places, and Nords using horses is simply against the canon.
You might be wondering what would replace cavarly. Well, ranged units for one. Theres not many of those, and they do offer a nice challenge, without most of the AI glitches.
Discuss.
Re: Remove AI cavarly - Johao - 09-01-2012
I agree, we cant have half-siege game maps due to calvary restrictions.
Although, that would certainly mean less horde diversity, there should be different game modes (close quarters and open field) to even out the fustration.
That way, calvary players wont complain having to play in a cav unfriendly map.
Re: Remove AI cavarly - Dax - 09-01-2012
i like the cav wave loads of XP for the players that like XPÂ ;D
Re: Remove AI cavarly - Kwal - 09-01-2012
I agree, all the times I've made it to the prince wave is because of exploiting the cavalry AI of the knights and it doesn't even suit the Nords. However, Nord cavalry does make it harder for our horsemen since they continuously have enemies on their tail and really can't afford a misstep. More archers and pikemen could work here, but I have a feeling the kiting will become too easy..
Re: Remove AI cavarly - Daenerys - 09-01-2012
"WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU MAD?!"
It is so funny to watch how nord cavalry crush unaware and reckless swadia recruits. Seriously nord cavalry makes hardest and most interesting challenge for swadia cavalry.
Re: Remove AI cavarly - Lav - 09-01-2012
I have defended cavalry numerous times on these boards.
But frankly, I wouldn't mind a map or two with disabled horses (that is, even if you take one, you still spawn footed, and bots spawn footed too).
As per the original suggestion though, I'm not sure. Personally I think if we remove AI cavalry, player cavalry should be removed as well. But then there's no Swadia remaining - I mean, a pure-infantry faction with archers for ranged combat == Nords in my book, and then the mod could as well be named "Nord Civil War". :-(
Re: Remove AI cavarly - Senni - 09-01-2012
(09-01-2012, 07:37 PM)Kwal link Wrote: I agree, all the times I've made it to the prince wave is because of exploiting the cavalry AI of the knights and it doesn't even suit the Nords. However, Nord cavalry does make it harder for our horsemen since they continuously have enemies on their tail and really can't afford a misstep. More archers and pikemen could work here, but I have a feeling the kiting will become too easy..Hardest bit about the knight wave for cav is the archers, even before the nerf. Get your approach wrong and you get your horse taken out from underneath you :/.
EDIT: should have mentioned dodging cav is easy
Re: Remove AI cavarly - ComradeTemuzu - 09-01-2012
(09-01-2012, 09:00 PM)Lav link Wrote: I have defended cavalry numerous times on these boards.Word. That would be a good alternative.
But frankly, I wouldn't mind a map or two with disabled horses (that is, even if you take one, you still spawn footed, and bots spawn footed too).
As per the original suggestion though, I'm not sure. Personally I think if we remove AI cavalry, player cavalry should be removed as well. But then there's no Swadia remaining - I mean, a pure-infantry faction with archers for ranged combat == Nords in my book, and then the mod could as well be named "Nord Civil War". :-(