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Change orange legendaries
#31
(11-03-2020, 03:11 PM)Woody Wrote:
(11-03-2020, 02:57 PM)Malong Wrote: Yes it's a form of that. If it was unclear, my implication was that I would not seriously consider filing that feature request as it has already been rejected.

You also ignored the rest of my post, i.e. "that's how online RPGs work."

People opinions can and do change over time. Requests for Ni have been rejected then half a year later added maybe not In the forum suggested but a similar one.

Sure, but I would bet on this specific request getting rejected again for the same reasons as before.

(11-03-2020, 03:11 PM)Woody Wrote: The quote "that's how online RPGs work." says nothing when game devs do get involved in the market when they feel like something should be done. When I suggest we needed a gold sink [over many threads] years ago and what happened? One day we got the biggest gold sink ever being upgrades. I'm not going to take credit on that idea but I'll say I did put a light on the subject so a fix could be made.

We got the gold sink 2 years ago at this point well now Its possibly time to make an item sink for legendaries given.

There were gold sinks long before awakened legendaries, and other conversations with admins and devs showed that they wanted more gold sinks. Correlation isn't causation: there is no evidence that your suggestion was the reason that heavy gold costs of awakening legendaries were implemented.
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#32
(11-03-2020, 03:42 PM)Woody Wrote:
(11-03-2020, 03:34 PM)Forward Wrote: Is that bad thing?

Are you joking?

Half of the game's progression In items is currently not relevant. 

Why buy [most] of the Green items when a lot of Light Blue are so cheap
Why buy [a lot] of the Dark Blue items when some Orange Legendaries are so cheap
Why buy [some] of the Orange Legendaries when a few Red Legendaries are so cheap

Half of the game's models are not being used/wanted.

It happens in all games. And in many games not-highend items worth nothing, so NI economy is great in this regard, thanks to upgrades gold/mats sink. As being said in another thread, many NI features are not working like was planned initially, like crafting, house system or 16 hero classes. The game also doesn't need so many items apparently, like your Kriegsmesser example. But it's a mod, not AAA game, so you might expect some flaws. If NI2 will happen I'm sure developers will learn from NI1 mistakes. Some of problems of 2020 were impossible to predict in 2013, but orange legendaries problem is less important amongst them.
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#33
Not being funny, the mod is 8 years old. The amount of blue craftables is insane. Thats why there price is so shit. You can't expect everything to be the same price as how it used to be when mats were somewhat rare.
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#34
(11-03-2020, 03:50 PM)Malong Wrote: Sure, but I would bet on this specific request getting rejected again for the same reasons as before.

Being the same reason over and over again can once again change over time. Us normal people don't get much info on why requests fail. 

I could If I wanted to post this request message form right to the devs but I wanted to see the public perspective on this and how its changes over time. Seems like it has changed as the market has became more apparent for how much people want gold. 

Ni has been out for almost 10 years at this point but you don't need to go too far back to see how different it was. Think right now If you told someone in 2014-2015 Vgs is about as cheap as Grinder people would be just a bit surprised.

(11-03-2020, 03:50 PM)Malong Wrote: There were gold sinks long before awakened legendaries, and other conversations with admins and devs showed that they wanted more gold sinks. Correlation isn't causation: there is no evidence that your suggestion was the reason that heavy gold costs of awakening legendaries were implemented.

In the 1st round how much gold was taken out of the economy just with a few people upgrading? Just me I did 22m + 5m + 5m I think If I remember right It was 100-150m or so. So to say we had gold sinks before Is right but its such a small comparison It makes me laugh. This was and still is a tax for wealthy people that never existed before. 

I did not state I was the reason It was put in. I said, "I'll say I did put a light on the subject so a fix could be made." Putting a light on a subject does not mean they even looked at my suggestion... All It means Is I did talk about the problems of having so much gold back then and why we need a big gold sink. [tax for wealthy people]



(11-03-2020, 04:09 PM)Fendi Wrote: Not being funny, the mod is 8 years old. The amount of blue craftables is insane. Thats why there price is so shit. You can't expect everything to be the same price as how it used to be when mats were somewhat rare.

Mats being common Is a small problem I see but It has no effect on why some orange legendaries are so cheap.

Thread is locked but ill post this as It seems somewhat related to this thread at this point. 

[Image: be879f7fd9073611425be64d4ca086e6.png]

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#35
Defender Armor (RG) was once a Craftable using a shitton of mats to craft it (i believe around 24m worth in mats?)
Because so few crafted it, it was made into a legendary

with the Kriegsmesser, something similar could be done, eg. making it the red wormbane equivalent
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#36
(11-03-2020, 04:38 PM)Kriegstofu Wrote: Defender Armor (RG) was once a Craftable using a shitton of mats to craft it (i believe around 24m worth in mats?)
Because so few crafted it, it was made into a legendary

with the Kriegsmesser, something similar could be done, eg. making it the red wormbane equivalent

Um, big difference being Def armour and Red/Blue Imp took a long time to craft back then.

This was when getting a lump a run was lucky sometimes. Lumps at 60k good times.

[Image: 9bc0f7aef032e8493ad9283d6e937fa5.png]

At the time it was about 25m to craft ye but It was once over 40m

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#37
(11-03-2020, 04:14 PM)Woody Wrote: In the 1st round how much gold was taken out of the economy just with a few people upgrading? Just me I did 22m + 5m + 5m I think If I remember right It was 100-150m or so. So to say we had gold sinks before Is right but its such a small comparison It makes me laugh. This was and still is a tax for wealthy people that never existed before. 

I did not state I was the reason It was put in. I said, "I'll say I did put a light on the subject so a fix could be made." Putting a light on a subject does not mean they even looked at my suggestion... All It means Is I did talk about the problems of having so much gold back then and why we need a big gold sink. [tax for wealthy people]

It was the existence of the gold sink, and not the magnitude, that was your point though. Mentioning the magnitude now is irrelevant when it wasn't your original point. "[A] gold sink" not "[A] gold sink of 100-150m or so:"

(11-03-2020, 03:11 PM)Woody Wrote: When I suggest we needed a gold sink [over many threads] years ago what happened?

(11-03-2020, 04:14 PM)Woody Wrote: I did not state I was the reason It was put in. I said, "I'll say I did put a light on the subject so a fix could be made." Putting a light on a subject does not mean they even looked at my suggestion... All It means Is I did talk about the problems of having so much gold back then and why we need a big gold sink. [tax for wealthy people]

You linked your suggestion to the result (see quote above). But sure, we'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

(11-03-2020, 04:14 PM)Woody Wrote: Thread is locked but ill post this as It seems somewhat related to this thread at this point. 


My post was a joke. I was not actually suggesting to remove the feathers, orichcalcum, fragments from recipes.
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#38
Magnitude is directly linked to my suggestions from all those years ago. I shouldn't need to clarify that when I draw parallels between upgrades and the ideas I had. How petty.

If that wasn't a real suggestion it didn't make for a good joke.

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#39
(11-03-2020, 05:18 PM)Woody Wrote: Magnitude is directly linked to my suggestions from all those years ago. I shouldn't need to clarify that when I draw parallels between upgrades and the ideas I had. How petty.

Petty? It's a valid response when you give no indication of this, nor source. Either way: "[O]ther conversations with admins and devs showed that they wanted more gold sinks."

(11-03-2020, 05:18 PM)Woody Wrote: If that wasn't a real suggestion it didn't make for a good joke.

/sigh, it was never a joke. It was meant to show the absurdity of the post to which I was replying, particularly this: "Each legendary has a baseline[;] I could not care less if [everything] was only 2x ish the price of the house crafting version. I don't care how low prices get but i do care about it going lower than crafting costs."

The price is what the market will bear. Few people want the orange legendaries that are outclassed by two whole tiers of items. "Yo G, this should be worth more cuz it be orange, and orange soda be da best, biatch" isn't a good point, particularly when the dev response was been that the community dictates price on whatever basis it chooses. Thankfully, the primary basis is stats.
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#40
(11-03-2020, 05:58 PM)Malong Wrote: no indication

I don't need to prove I've made feature quests on this matter when you can look for them. This Is really is petty.  

(11-03-2020, 05:58 PM)Malong Wrote: nor source.


If you wanted one you could find one. We both have the same tool called "Search".

Here is one that I still like where I said "It could be a massive gold sink (The positives from this point are so big just made it the top point rather than writing a paragraph that will be forgotten in weeks)" In other threads, I talked about why in detail. You can find them yourself because I'm not doing all of your homework. 

Here is my reference Mr Petty --> https://forum.nordinvasion.com/showthrea...+gold+sink

I suggested this on November 19th, 2017 when upgrades were Monday, January 29th, 2018. 

I think that one Is a good one because you can draw so many parallels between this and upgrades. This got a no but If I was to guess It was only to do with the "combining characters" as they said. The idea of a big gold sink they could have wanted by then but either way "I did put a light on the subject." before we got it. 

(11-03-2020, 05:58 PM)Malong Wrote: "[O]ther conversations with admins and devs showed that they wanted more gold sinks."

Yea and? All I'm saying is this "I did put a light on the subject so a fix could be made." It doesn't stop others from having the same idea. Once again how Petty can you be?

(11-03-2020, 05:58 PM)Malong Wrote: I don't care how low prices get but i do care about it going lower than crafting costs."

Ye, I agree. A. B. and C. help with the "going lower than crafting costs".

A - Makes them wanted more

B - Makes them wanted more

C - Would make a some want fixed price they can not fall below. 


Like I said In this thread You can do C by itself or you can do C + A or C + B. I don't care what happens I just want something to happen.  

(11-03-2020, 05:58 PM)Malong Wrote: The price is what the market will bear. Few people want the orange legendaries that are outclassed by two whole tiers of items. "Yo G, this should be worth more cuz it be orange, and orange soda be da best, biatch" isn't a good point, particularly when the dev response was been that the community dictates price on whatever basis it chooses. Thankfully, the primary basis is stats.

The difference being I want this game to still have a somewhat clear progression. Right now speaking widely orange legendaries are the only ones that take a step backwards to go forwards. This usability buff was once worth more to the community but now It has no bearing just about on why Orange legendaries are wanted.

A - Just makes them Into Red

B - Gives a buff to the thing they are already best at

C - Makes sure the market cant value them to little 

Like I said before the system doesn't value Orange any lower than Reds already. This being other than event rewards and upgrading (upgrading being new In the grand scheme of things). Considering Event rewards just about never happen Its only upgrades that tell us they should be valued differently. Stats wise given I think we can agree all red are worth the same ish In the system my question is... Are Orange loots that different? Put It this way imagine if Orange legendaries turned Red but had the same stats. Fundamentally they are In the same boat with all reds but arent they already In the same boat? The system values Orange loots just about as much as Reds being I cant clearly see people have a higher chance to loot Orange stuff. At least we could agree Orange loots In the system are closer to Red considering how they seem to have similar or the same drop rates. We have some Orange loots on Rag and some Red on Normal so that argument cant be applied either.   

I see them as just about the same as reds already just with a buff none uses. 

"community dictates price"... Hell, you couldn't face reality to agree with me even tho what you suggested [Link] goes under the (C.) idea. Devs play a big role In the market as they control what you pay and what you pay with. They make the system which has a bigger effect than the community in full. Without upgrades people like myself would probably be at 300m gold or afg at this point. 

I would read this post If anything [Link] I suggested uncrafting all the way back In 2016 and Its probably been suggested before that. At least 1 dev probably still likes the idea.

Love the post after It as well "Why do you think Faravin "quit" NI." ~ Kaasovic 2016

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