Warden Vs Master peltast

[Stillicho]

You just compared Volcanic Daggers, a top tier legendary, to a War Bow, a marketplace bow. Why would I even look bother looking at this? It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Honda Civic...

Wouldn't you compare the Typhoon or w/e the fast one is plus Zephyr arrows vs. Volcanic if your doing fast vs. fast for dps comparison?

The thing is... i didn't.

The one and only thing that there from War Bow is 85 bow attack speed rating, which is highlighted, because it different and it's even more than Typhoon has(it means that Typhon has even less "shoot per second" stat).

Fun thing that 85 speed rating is also the average between Typhoon and Tempest. So it would be more fair to compare 58p damage as bow + arrows to Volcanic's 60p(in the case of having already tested bow with 85 spd rating). But seems like it's already hard to understand, so i wouldn't bother.

+2 Dmg or +2 Armour does nothing in this game   . I would never spend millions on it or grind for a thousand hours. 

I also would never look at any of the other stats in a weapon besides the Damage or Speed of a weapon, like the velocity or damage drop off over distance. After all, it's only Warband.

[Narvad]

I also would never look at any of the other stats in a weapon besides the Damage or Speed of a weapon, like the velocity or damage drop off over distance. After all, it's only Warband.

You probably confused yourself with one of that marksmanship games, where you staying in one place and shooting in dummies situated on different distances/attitudes.
In this modification, enemy is spawns and coming for you, and when it comes close enough no one that matters any more, except ability to kill as many nords as you can with minimum required shots/throws/swings and fastest speed.
Those who are left behind don't ruining your barricades or hitting your shielder(usually), and they can be dealt with after.

So what's the point of archers then? Which, as we found out already, inferior to Melee/Ranged hybrid on the close-middle distances. To pick up the ranged bots, which don't harm anyone, and get yourself nice score?

[Stillicho]

I also would never look at any of the other stats in a weapon besides the Damage or Speed of a weapon, like the velocity or damage drop off over distance. After all, it's only Warband.

You probably confused yourself with one of that marksmanship games, where you staying in one place and shooting in dummies situated on different distances/attitudes.
In this modification, enemy is spawns and coming for you, and when it comes close enough no one that matters any more, except ability to kill as many nords as you can with minimum required shots/throws/swings and fastest speed.
Those who are left behind don't ruining your barricades or hitting your shielder(usually), and they can be dealt with after.

So what's the point of archers then? Which, as we found out already, inferior to Melee/Ranged hybrid on the close-middle distances. To pick up the ranged bots, which don't harm anyone, and get yourself nice score?

If you don't think +2 Damage makes a difference, why even play to grind out all that gear....uninstall.

[Alphaa]

Without reading it all I gotta say Warden feels worse when kiting, a buff to athletics would be much appreciated, or a nerf to MP tho we all prefer the buff I suppose. But apart from that both sides have their advantages and disadvantages.

[Stillicho]

Without reading it all I gotta say Warden feels worse when kiting, a buff to athletics would be much appreciated, or a nerf to MP tho we all prefer the buff I suppose. But apart from that both sides have their advantages and disadvantages.

+1, could careless about the weapon changes. With the gear the way it is, feels a little slugish on archer compared to skirmisher.

[Narvad]

If you don't think +2 Damage makes a difference, why even play to grind out all that gear....uninstall.

I never said or implied it.
That's why i didn't quoted that part - it seems like you are speaking to yourself.

I guess i should make it clear a bit:

just a tiny spoiler

I saw that in the thread there was mention about that "speed rating" stat is different for Bows and Throwing weapons. I remembered that i was doing some tests on that in native, trying to find out how this "rating" applies to measured values.
Long time before I've made some measurements of shooting speed of War bow with different proficiencies; some time after that I'm also tested the "Throw per second" parameter of different throwing weapons(doesn't matter the reason actually).

Now, returning to this thread.

You just compared Volcanic Daggers, a top tier legendary, to a War Bow, a marketplace bow. Why would I even look bother looking at this? It's like comparing a Ferrari to a Honda Civic...

The one and only thing that there from War Bow is 85 bow attack speed rating, which is highlighted, because it different and it's even more than Typhoon has(it means that Typhon has even less "shoot per second" stat).

In the tests of effective shoot/throw speed only matters such parameter as "Speed Rating". What's the point of speaking about other stats such as damage, when it wouldn't be showed in calculations?
That's why i took my measurements of shooting speed of War Bow, which has 85 speed rating(+3 more than Typhoon), and showed that 100 speed rating of throwing weapon is more than 85 speed rating of bow weapon.
And since 85 speed rating of bow weapon is more than 82 speed rating of bow weapon, 100 speed rating of throwing weapon is more than 82 speed rating of bow weapon. In short: if A > B > C, then A > C.
Hopefully now clear enough.

When you comparing the colour of a car, else than a colour doesn't matter. Would it be Ferrari or a Honda Civic.

Now the second part:

Fun thing that 85 speed rating is also the average between Typhoon and Tempest. So it would be more fair to compare 58p damage as bow + arrows to Volcanic's 60p(in the case of having already tested bow with 85 spd rating). But seems like it's already hard to understand, so i wouldn't bother.

Since there's no high end bow with 85 speed rating, but there's Typhoon with 82 speed rating and 60p damage(with best quiver) and Tempest with 88 speed rating and 56p damage, you could clearly imagine that existing Bow with 85 speed rating would have 58p damage(average between Typhoon and Tempest both damage and speed). In the math it's called "interpolation" i guess. You also can find out that 3 speed rating = 2p damage trade, which you can see is made here, could be found on another bows within the same tier of quality(e.g. Kings Will/Ebony, Hurricane/Fiendish, Ullrs/Stag.)
It's not that 2 damage is disappeared. It's that it was traded for the speed rating to fit the already existed tests.

some nerd stuff

By the way Tempest would have ~0.6688 shoot per second, while having 56p damage. Both of that stats is lower than correlative stats of Volcanic Daggers.
And if the formula is linear(and there's no any mistakes in test, beside measurement error), then 1 point of speed rating of Bow weapon would be equal to ~0.0076 shoots per second while 1 point of speed rating of Throwing weapon would be equal to ~0,00735 throws per second.
Which means that ~96-97 speed rating of bows is equal to 100 speed rating of throwing weapons.

[Winter]

some nerd stuff

By the way Tempest would have ~0.6688 shoot per second, while having 56p damage. Both of that stats is lower than correlative stats of Volcanic Daggers.
And if the formula is linear(and there's no any mistakes in test, beside measurement error), then 1 point of speed rating of Bow weapon would be equal to ~0.0076 shoots per second while 1 point of speed rating of Throwing weapon would be equal to ~0,00735 throws per second.
Which means that ~96-97 speed rating of bows is equal to 100 speed rating of throwing weapons.

Nice work on all of the testing and math. However, I have been told that the speed rating is not calculated linearly and the WPF instead counts as a subtraction of percentage from the time it takes to draw, meaning items with slower speeds are more affected by WPF differences (20% of a high time to fire is a larger number than 20% of a smaller time to fire), and that each weapon type has a different calculation for determining how long it takes to fire/swing based on the "speed" stat. I'm not sure how accurate that is, but I haven't read anything to the contrary.

This is still just one fairly rare item, and I'm not sure it is indicative of an overpowering of Warden by Master Peltast. Some additional item comparisons and testing would be fantastic. Maybe the Volcanic Daggers should be changed based on this data. The drop-off over distance should also be considered, but there isn't much I can say on that. Good argument.