Community Manager?

[Maroon]

[quote author=Maroon link=topic=24480.msg171093#msg171093 date=1395497526]
From my point of view, having Hande in a server with 500 kills is more an exception than a rule. I have seen him in public servers plenty of times, and almost always he's either joking around with trickster smoke bombs, or slashing at the shieldwall with whatever weird weapon he has chosen to take with him that day.
[quote author=AnonymousHero link=topic=24480.msg171090#msg171090 date=1395496738]
the community manager should interact in a healthy way with the community. it is this behaviour that has been fed in the community as of late tat was not tollerated in the past. people will behave in a community the way they see others behave and tbh we don't have anyone setting an example atm.

What kind of behavior are you referring to here? You say that a community manager should interact with the community, then jump to "it is this behavior that has been fed in the community". Are you saying that a lack of interaction has led to the community's behavior? If so, what kind of behavior from our community managers could have stopped this change?
[/quote]
a kid without parents/teachers vs a kid with parents/teachers...which is more likely to interact in a socially acceptable way?...use your brain a little. if there are no standerds being set then of course people will run in anarchy derp
[/quote]

You seem to think of NI community members as people without brains ready to run into anarchy. While this is a fairly accurate description of your average internet user, I feel that the NI community isn't quite as stupid. Yes, any big group of people needs guidelines to function properly, and NI is no exception to that, but I don't think we completely lack guidance. It's not like anyone can do whatever the hell they want here. I agree that the amount of guidance by the developers is something they can improve upon, but I suggest you open your eyes a bit more, and look around. NI has not fallen into any kind of anarchy, it is more that certain members of the community have taken to borderline behavior (again, my opinion), which has decreased the openness of the community.

[Yvain]

2) A shift from the dictatorship present in NI atm. The fact that I have had to make a new account for this post for fear of being shun and banned for having an opinion like rex did earlier is disgusting.
4) a community manager who interacts with the actual community and takes their advice on things rather than the current who doesent speak with the community and ignores their pleas/suggestions without any evidence as to why or why not!

Nord Invasion has existed for almost 3 years. You should be understanding with developers who have tried to please the fans for a long time, spending free time and beyond their professional activity or studies.
As regards people who have been banned, better not judge if you don't know everything about the incident.

[YunYun]

Hello,

2) A shift from the dictatorship present in NI atm. The fact that I have had to make a new account for this post for fear of being shun and banned for having an opinion like rex did earlier is disgusting.

I hope you're using a new pc or some sort of VPN then, 'cause it's really easy to track multi-accounts :

Example on another forum

IP,
Users using that IP
Other IPs used by those users
[Image: 992840evid.png]

3) Devs other than kip playing the mod

Well, I see Hyper quite often when he's not abroad or busy. He plays a lot on his undercover character.

4) a community manager who interacts with the actual community

I'm a bit curious about your point of view, what kind of interaction do you expect ?


I feel like the only problem here is Hande's description as "Community manager" on the forums. He doesn't do all the things you could expect from a community manager, but it doesn't mean that nobody cares about those things. Admins and dev meet up periodically to discuss about feature requests and the future of NI : we are listening to your opinion.

I don't like to see Hande being blamed for a lack of community management because, in my opinion, that's actually a team (the NI team) job, so we can either debate about Hande's title or try to discuss about what's missing. So, once again, I'm curious about your opinion, how can we improve the situation ?

[Hande]

Hey Rift !

I think you posted this because some of you AUS players don't like me so much for several reasons, or you also have something against me.
I'll answer to some of your points here:

2) A shift from the dictatorship present in NI atm.

What do you mean with dictatorship ? Please explain better.

The fact that I have had to make a new account for this post for fear of being shun and banned for having an opinion like rex did earlier is disgusting.

I'm not going to ban you because of this. It was different with Rex.

3) Devs other than kip playing the mod (if you don’t play with the community how will you know what’s best for the game?)

I do play this mod a lot. I mostly play in Normal servers to help out new players.

Perhaps this is only me and I have been spoilt by the exceptional community manager that Barristan was but as others who have posted/commented before me have said…Hande was a terrible choice.

Okey this is where you are wrong. I have been titled as Community Manager by Jez so basically I've been doing this since the beginning.

4) a community manager who interacts with the actual community and takes their advice on things rather than the current who doesent speak with the community and ignores their pleas/suggestions without any evidence as to why or why not!

Okey, is this why you don't like me ?
I do speak and interact with this mod community almost everyday and I don't ingore any suggestions players post to forums. I just say no and lock them down if it is not suitable for this mod.

I would like to recommend a new community manager.

Okey, who do you recommend ?

I played in NI in its early stages and it makes me sad to see how the mod has become.

Players make this mod community. I cannot be your mom or dad to guide you everyday.

It was once frowned upon for a dev to join a server and carry a team all the way to odin (destroying the fun, out of range of loots and exp not to mention a crash at the end largely due to high amounts of odin spears being flung between dev and boss).

Okey, so you want me to stop playing this mod and help out players sometimes to get faster to higher waves or help out new players ?
When I'm playing and killing bots I always try to be in xp range so everyone can get xp, money and perhaps some loot. I don't solo.


Let me know if you want to know something else. I'm more than happy to answer to them.

Regards,
Dictator Hande, The Evil Community Manager.

[oposum]

I hope you're using a new pc or some sort of VPN then, 'cause it's really easy to track multi-accounts :

Example on another forum

IP,
Users using that IP
Other IPs used by those users
[Image: 992840evid.png]

Just to jump in, if you use normal packet from your ISP you will have dynamic IP adress, so just restarting your router will change it. Even if you're too lazy to do that, you can just use proxy server to hide your IP adress. Tracking multi-accounts by IP isn't the best approach since it's possible, extremly unlikely though, that 2 different people who use the same ISP and forum to show as multi-account.

[YunYun]

@oposum

Yeah, that's right, but few people know about that, and even fewer bother to do anything. Moreover, IP-tracking is available in any kind of forum and often enough to spot multi-account, that was just a simple example.
All in all, I just wanted our AnonymousHero to be ready for

Hey Rift !

Enough off-topic now, that evil community manager must be lurking around.

[j0n]

So much hate for Hande recently, it's odd.

It's also laughable to blame Hande for the current problems in the community, the player base has created these divisions and divides themselves with the whole 'we're better than you noobs' mentality that's going around with certain individuals far too much right now.

While I can't argue that it doesn't 'appear' that hande interacts with the community much, there's no saying what goes on behind the scenes, also I spend plenty of time in normal servers these days it's a fairly common sight to see hande join up and when he does he certainly doesn't go off soloing, he tends to wait around till vet pikes to let other people get the kills and exp.

But I suppose it's easy to start crying and pointing fingers at the 'community manager' because things aren't exactly as you want them.

[human_being]

But I suppose it's easy to start crying and pointing fingers at the 'community manager' because things aren't exactly as you want them.

Exactly what I thought.

I highly recommend not to take this "request" - or whatever this topic wants to be - too serious.
I see no point here.

[Birdtalon]

Don't hate on Hande he did an excellent job whilst I was a developer and I'm sure he still does a great job now. The Nord Invaison team has changed dramatically since that time but Hande has always been a good guy.

[clickeverywhere]

The post by Rex, for those interested: http://forum.nordinvasion.com/index.php?...625.0.html


Here is what I don't agree with:
1. For the claims that Hande and devs aren't active enough ingame, that might just have to do with when and where you are playing. Everyone has a different schedule and different obligations. I see Hande on normal servers and checking in on hard servers near midnight my time.

2. There have been many posts critical of the direction this mod has taken. The only times players have been banned, as far as I can recall, are when they are tactless in their approach. It's not a good idea to go about screaming obscenities at the devs no matter how valid your points may be. Players can give criticism without being offensive about it. Treat the devs as people and be polite. It goes a long way.

3. I don't know what undercover accounts devs use so I can't comment on whether they are active enough (what exactly would be enough, anyway).

4. It's not just the community manager that dictates the direction of the mod. I'm quite certain that the devs collaborate with each other to determine what changes are made. Hypernoma has said before that he reads every feature request.  I don't know what pleas/suggests you are referring to that you say are ignored. If you just mean he doesn't respond to every thread, then I suppose you could see it as ignoring behavior.

What I have to say on the matter:
I do agree that Hande doesn't do much in the way of actually interacting with players on the forums. Oftentimes he may be too blunt in his rejection of ideas without giving adequate explanation. This is something I agree can be improved upon, but players should also give more thought into what they suggest before posting it (or use  the search function).

2. As of late it feels as if there hasn't been much communication from the devs. More frequent posts in the News and Updates section could help. I always like to hear how the mod is moving forward. We were told most recently about the month of the purge, but since that was posted I haven't heard anything. Is the purging over? Is it still going on? What now? We've also heard about the plans for a new loot system, but how is that coming along? I check the forum daily and the majority of it seems dead aside from the occasional post in recruitment and dumping area (trade forums are active though).

3. This is more of a problem with players than with devs, but I think it should be brought to everybody's attention. If you play on say a hard server without a dev character, it can be frustrating to see how little effort some players put forth. I play as a shielder for the most part, yet on public servers I find myself frequently at or near the top of the scoreboard. What does this show? A lack of effort? A lack of skill? Maybe just astounding incompetence? I see players go from wave 1-20 with fewer than the number of waves in kills to their name (and they aren't going spectator for barricades/tomes/medic boxes either so their score isn't getting deflated in that way). After bots stop coming to the shield line, at least five players will just stand there doing nothing, I assume waiting for others to finish the wave for them by taking the necessary risks. I can understand players who are shielding or playing full-time medic having very few kills (or no kills) over the course of twenty waves, but for an archer or pikeman? How should I respond to this as a player? As an admin, even? Should I just kick players who don't carry their weight? Who don't risk anything for the loot and experience they receive? How can one rationalize the archer with less than half of the shielders kills? I can't kick these people for AFK or leeching because they really aren't, they just show enough activity to prove they aren't AFK and they're not leeching. Because a rate of fire of two arrows per minute is not technically AFK.

Can admins kick players for lack of effort? Lack of contribution? We need some harsher penalties for these behaviors, because that's the biggest problem I'm seeing now in servers. Unless you experience it yourself--taking the risks to move the team forward, yet getting nothing in the end--you will not understand it. I do not wish to step out of bounds as an admin, and I do not wish to act in a manner unbefitting an admin. What is there I can do when faced with half a team of underachievers toeing the line of inactivity?