Build points

[Fendi]

Bring back old system.
Bring back old Twigs.

Locked.

[Kaasovic]

Old system worked 6 years, no issues, I bet this mod will be played more if people wouldnt wipe every 2 times cause noone like the current system or undertands it... i mean, its good if u implement new stuff, but there was obv no reason to change it.. and u see the shitstorm now.

No issues is exaggerated. As stated before the old system was prone to duplication glitches and had the possibility that items would disappear.

[Malong]

As for the all of the of tower defense games I have played, all relied on skill and knowledge when certain "items" had to be "placed" etc. I don't know why the "tower defense" strategy in NordInvasion has to be skilless to a point where you can brain afk, but whatever I don't think that discussing this would be on topic.

I recall you once brought up Killing Floor as an example. I played the hell out of that game (check my Steam achievements), and I will tell you it is _absolutely_ "brain afk." Just like NI, you just find the camp spot and fire when they come in. And it's even simpler than NI because any team composition can win and there aren't barricades. And Killing Floor 2 is even easier.

Killing Floor 2 was brought up as an example of co-op games where the rewards were purely cosmetic and did not affect any stats.
I have only played it for 4 hours so I won't be able to confirm that it is indeed a brain afking game. The four hours I played I found the game very challenging.

Yes, you're correct, it wasn't directly about the challenge. But the first four hours of any game that involves levels will be challenging if you don't play the mode for your level. This is especially true when the "balance" of the enemies is based purely on their stats relative to yours, and player stats increase by leveling. I find it VERY hard to believe that you had a difficult time with Beginner mode in KF2.

---

Depends of the minority we're talking about.

Take some new players. Show them a typical run.
"See, we put 28 barricades on that chokepoint, then we all shoot the stupid bots while they are stuck there"

Now imagine what the results of this poll would be:
1: "This look so fun, how do I join?"
2: "Seems dumb, grindy and boring, why would I play this?"

The answer to #2 is found in this post

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Infantry in NI has 2 roles: shielding and slashing. Implementing extra HP and forcing infantry to walk for kills is bad thing, because they block shooting and slow run down. The game goal is to kill Odin, not to get more kills. Game design should encourage teamplay, not frag contest.

It's funny how you are all about forcing the development team to listen to the community, but when it comes to infantry they have to be forced to follow a directed play style. The purpose of infantry is infantry. People can play the character as they wish and should not be limited in their way of doing so. Oh and your game design should encourage teamplay statement is a bit odd when you are all against a support system that forces more teamplay on the players.

I disagree with this assessment that the support system forces more teamplay. There is no coordination for full public servers because people don't know what support items others are bringing, and most won't change characters due to fear of losing their spot. Many public teams are just destined to lose despite not really doing anything wrong.

Events are still easy, meaning the net effect is you hurt public players. In the end, you didn't make the game more challenging per se, but rather just added a technicality that teams have to pass. I don't consider this to be a challenge, though some people would.

[Forward]

The goal is to make a good game, not good code behind it. Commercial successful and popular software has horrible code mess behind it more often then you think.

This is absolute bullshit. Horrible code means poor performance, trust me.

First, you make something work. Later, you optimize performance. Not other way around. Because if your feature is not working, performance is irrelevant. If your feature wins you the market you release new version with optimization and such. Many games release in Early Access now, because it allows to secure market share and continue development based on players experience.

Because there is no reason to optimize, let's say, polygon count on new Twigs model if as it's happened it's better just to drop new model to the trash bin and use old one again.

Reason to have script is providing equal game opportunity for everyone. Until quests in the game focused on Boss lasthits the script is needed. Don't pretend it's equal opportunities now. Just believe me, guy with Cursed Deadshot has it.

Without the script everyone has an equal opportunity as well. Landing the last hit is completely random. Adding a script will make this only worse as players with a Cursed Dead Shot can tell exactly when they should land the last shot.

I even asked you. Don't pretend script doesn't exist now. So Pandora's box is already opened, only way to have equal footing now - to have it opened for everyone. Rather change lasthit-orinted quest mechanic.


I don't answer other your points, because your views is completely opposite and it's more or less pointless to discuss it here. Here we're discussing Ken's wonderful idea.

[Kaasovic]

The goal is to make a good game, not good code behind it. Commercial successful and popular software has horrible code mess behind it more often then you think.

This is absolute bullshit. Horrible code means poor performance, trust me.

First, you make something work. Later, you optimize performance. Not other way around. Because if your feature is not working, performance is irrelevant. If your feature wins you the market you release new version with optimization and such. Many games release in Early Access now, because it allows to secure market share and continue development based on players experience.

Because there is no reason to optimize, let's say, polygon count on new Twigs model if as it's happened it's better just to drop new model to the trash bin and use old one again.

Reason to have script is providing equal game opportunity for everyone. Until quests in the game focused on Boss lasthits the script is needed. Don't pretend it's equal opportunities now. Just believe me, guy with Cursed Deadshot has it.

Without the script everyone has an equal opportunity as well. Landing the last hit is completely random. Adding a script will make this only worse as players with a Cursed Dead Shot can tell exactly when they should land the last shot.

I even asked you. Don't pretend script doesn't exist now. So Pandora's box is already opened, only way to have equal footing now - to have it opened for everyone. Rather change lasthit-orinted quest mechanic.


I don't answer other your points, because your views is completely opposite and it's more or less pointless to discuss it here. Here we're discussing Ken's wonderful idea.

Your arguments start to make less and less sense to me.

Why would a developer take an extra step to do the optimization after everything is done? A good coder will write efficient code nonetheless. I think we ran two tests in a closed environment before we merged the feature in development, so technically speaking it was working. I think you are smart enough to see that we do not have the capacity to have dedicated testing servers, nor do we have a system that would process generated testing data. Basically everything that ends up in the master branch will be tested by the players.

As for the health script. I have yet to see a screenshot where the bar is present. So unless someone can provide me with a PoC it will not be added. What does "I even asked you." refers to?

[Malong]

As for the health script. I have yet to see a screenshot where the bar is present. So unless someone can provide me with a PoC it will not be added.

Here you go:

Spoiler

[Kaasovic]

As for the health script. I have yet to see a screenshot where the bar is present. So unless someone can provide me with a PoC it will not be added.

Here you go:

Spoiler

Oof forgot to say in 1.11+ èh. Doh.

[Malong]

As for the health script. I have yet to see a screenshot where the bar is present. So unless someone can provide me with a PoC it will not be added.

Here you go:

Spoiler

Oof forgot to say in 1.11+ èh. Doh.

I'm sorry, what do you mean?

[Kaasovic]

As for the health script. I have yet to see a screenshot where the bar is present. So unless someone can provide me with a PoC it will not be added.

Here you go:

Spoiler

Oof forgot to say in 1.11+ èh. Doh.

I'm sorry, what do you mean?

The screenshot you provided was uploaded before 1.11.0 was released. New countermeasures were deployed in the 1.11.0 update.

[Malong]

As for the health script. I have yet to see a screenshot where the bar is present. So unless someone can provide me with a PoC it will not be added.

Here you go:

Spoiler

Oof forgot to say in 1.11+ èh. Doh.

I'm sorry, what do you mean?

The screenshot you provided was uploaded before 1.11.0 was released. New countermeasures were deployed in the 1.11.0 update.

Oh, I see. Why does a screenshot have to be from 1.11 for it to be a valid proof of concept? Couldn't you just remove the countermeasures?