Bannerlord Hero Idea (Ni2)

[DR.]

Overview
Right now the 16 heroes feel very cramped as a lot of them overlap in core game pay when they could or should just be one class In my eyes. Nothing is stopping classes themselves having more items rather than making new classes to use those items. It should be possible that class stats can update with what items you are using. Doing this means you can customize how you want your class stats to be a bit.

Given the amount of combination of gear, we could have potentially... I would start with about 8 core classes, to begin with. You will not have unlimited control In what stats you have but you would have a lot more than the 16 fixed options. Each time a new item is Introduced It has the potential of making a new subclass for the game. Ideally, you introduce full sets of items that can change a class stats to make it a new subclass.

Adding in full sets at a time means you can balance around all combinations. You still can add 1 item at a time to classes but you may need to do some rebalancing after the full set is complete. I guess you can always plain beforehand what the rest of that sets stats are going to be.

We don't need a Warden hero and a Ranger hero. You would have Warden levels of power In ranged If using the right set of gear but you have the option to use different armour and weapons to become more like Ranger. If set up right doing a system like this means plays can pick parts of sets to become a middle class of sorts as well. I’ll give an example.  https://i.gyazo.com/51dd36a2a3876662adbb...0fd341.png

You don’t just have the 3 options here as you could use the full Warden set up but use only the Ranger helm instead. I'm imagining each Item type has a fixed value It takes away and adds to that class stats. I think a Ranger helm would take away some Archery skill and add some Ironflesh but stats wise It could be anything. A good example I like Is my Idea for Class 2. A mix of Sentry and Senti a player could forgo the bow to become a high risk commando with possibly better stats In melee vs all classes but a lot less hp/armour. 

In theory, If this idea worked you could make the 8 heroes I'm going to suggest Into just 4 or even 1 but I think that would just be too complicated. 

All Classes Summary

The titles I’ve given the classes are so you get an Idea real quick what the core class is about.

Ideally, each of the classes I suggest would have 1 to 2 sets of gear at the same rarity altho we could work up to that. You would have 1 armour set that has more armour but more weight vs other being lighter but less armour. Weapon wise the possibilities are endless as a “Throwing Master” may have Daggers, Throwing Spear and Axes all with different effects on the class stats Itself. 

Class 1 - Bow Master

1

Analysis
This class would be able to use the best Bows and Arrows in the game. You would have the option of a heavier more tanky armour that would lower your bow skill to the same as Class 2 If it was using Bow + Arrows + Sword. The benefit would be you are a lot tankier then class 2.

Positives
- Best possible bow/arrows skill when using Bow + Arrows + Sword + Light Armour Set
- Can be fast on his feet

Negatives
- Lowest melee skills
- Lowest armour with 1 set up and the other will about avg compared to other classes

Class 2 - Sword Master

2

Analysis
This class would have the best skill at using 1h’s and 2h’s at the same time. Class 7 will be able to get a better buff but It will need to focus on either 1h’s or 2h’s. This class will get better using both sword types at the same time so a set up of 1h + 2h + Shield. If you find you are not needed at the front lines you can always equip Bow and Arrows to get some skill In that area. Do note once you do this your melee skills go down a bit.

Positives
- Best possible 1h and 2h skill at the same time when using 1h + 2h + Shield + Heavier Armour Set
- Has ok Shield skill
- Is fast on his feet
- Still has bow skill as back up If you are not needed at the front lines

Negatives
- Class 1 just has more skill In Bows and 7 can just play more aggressively by having so much more armour. You can do both jobs just not as well or aggressively.

Class 3 - Polearm Master

3

Analysis
This class would be able to use the best Polearms in the game. To add this class can be a nice backup shielder If you run with Polearm1 + Polearm2 + Shield for the full buff. If you find you are not needed at the front lines you can always equip Throwing to get some skill In that area. Do note once you do this your melee skills go down.

Positives
- Best possible Polearm skill when using (Mangler) + (Elegy) + Shield + Heavier Armour Set
- Has ok shield skill
- Is fast on his feet
- Still has throwing skill as back up If you are not needed at the front lines

Negatives
- Class 4 just has more throwing skill and 7 can just play more aggressively by having so much more armour. You can do both jobs just not as well or aggressively.

Class 4 - Throwing Master

4

Analysis
This class would be able to use the best Throwing in the game. You would have the option of a heavier more tanky armour that would lower your Throwing skill to the same as class 3 If it was using 2x Throwing + Polearm. The benefit would be you are a lot tankier then class 3.

Positives
- Best possible Throwing skill when using 2x Throwing + Polearm + Light Armour Set
- Can be fast on his feet
- Good armour If you are willing to give up some skill in Throwing

Negatives
- 2nd lowest armour with the light set up
- 2nd lowest melee skills

Class 5 - Xbow Master

5

Analysis
This class would be able to use the best Xbow and Bolts in the game. You would have the option a heavier more tanky armour that would lower your Xbow skill to the same as class 6 If it was using Xbow + Bolts + Shield or 1h. The benefit would be you are a lot tankier then class 2.

Positives
- Best possible Xbow skill when using Xbow + Bolts + 1h + Light Armour Set
- Good armour and even better if you are willing to give up some skill in Xbows using the Heavier Armour Set

Negatives
- Slow class
- 3rd lowest melee skills

Class 6 - Shield Master

6

Analysis
This class would can have the best possible shield skill In the game. To be able to access the best shield skill you would need to play with 2x Shield + 1h. Wilie having more shield skill than Class 8 you have a lot less hp and armour to protect you. You do have some nice 1h's skill tho. 

Positives
- Best possible Shield skill when using 2x Shield + 1h + Heavier Armour Set
- Has 3rd best 1h skill
- Still has xbow skill as back up if you are not needed at the front lines

Negatives
- Class 5 just has more xbow skill.
-7 and 8 can just play more aggressively by having so much more armour.

Class 7 - Combat Master

7

Analysis
This class would have the best 1h skill or the best 2h skill In the game. To be able to have the best 2h skill you would need to do 2h Sword 2h Hammer + Shield and It works the same way with 1h’s. Class 2 will have better skill in both area’s if using both so it would be advised you pick 2h’s or 1h’s only for the best buff possible in the game. This class has the 2nd best armour and 3rd best shield skill. Overall this class is very powerful in melee and still has very good armour.

Positives
- Best possible 2h skill when using 2h Sword + 2h Hammer + Shield + Light Armour Set
- Best possible 1h skill when using 1h Sword + 1h Hammer + Shield + Light Armour Set
- 2nd best armour In the game
- Can use ok shields
- Is fast on his feet

Negatives
- No ranged skill.

Class 8 - Defensive Master

8

Analysis
This class is the tank of the game. This class has the best armour and the 2nd best shield skill. You don't need to have the best shield skill as your body is the shield. In a way you shield skill is a back up If you can't tank the wave.   

Positives
- Best possible Hp/other defensive stats given you use 1h + 2h + Shield + Heavier Armour Set
- 2nd best shield skill
- 3rd best 1h and 2h skill

Negatives
- No ranged skill.
- Class 6 has better shield skill then you if they take the risk
- slowest class
- Don't output a lot of damage in melee

Be a different request but I can see class 9 being a medic and 10 being an engineer. Medic being able to heal better than any other way and engineer maybe having best cades but also being able to repair them at some cost. The medic could have some ranged options like bows/xbows and the engineer could get the shields like the tower shield we have atm. I don't know maybe someone has a better idea If we wanted more core classes.

[Kriegstofu]

or just merge the pikeman and infantry class, problem solved.
zwei/halberdier/marauder = 2h/polearm Slashing with reduced throwing = The Knight
Hoplite/RG/Juggernaut =  Heaviest Armor/Shield with reduced throwing, 1h sword and spears = The Legionnaire
Legio/MP = Lighter Armor,  best Throwing and mediocre with both 1h, 25  and polearm = The Commando

Also merge 1h Bow and Ranger, a heavier bowman so to speak with mediocre shielding and 1h = The Ranger
Warden+2h bow hero is a pure glasscannon damage dealer, fast but weak = THe Assassin
Aventurier and Pavise into one, good shielding and armor and 1h with mediocre crossbow = The Paviseman
CM and RM into one, heavy weapon specialist, maybe some kind of small expolosives?, overall the slowest ranged class with the most firepower = The Heavy

[DR.]

1h Bow and Ranger, a heavier bowman so to speak with mediocre shielding and 1h = The Ranger
Warden+2h bow hero is a pure glasscannon damage dealer, fast but weak = THe Assassin

The idea of Sentinel cant survive on its own compared to Sentry given its current state. The benefits of 2h's will always outclass 1h's even if Senti had good shield skill. Making them Into one class gives rise to a new class of its own being a high risk melee hero with no ranged (that's if you pick that way to play). Your suggestion at best just makes Aventurier or PC with a bow.

Wardens downside Is Its armour the same way the thing that stops Ranger being Op Is Its skill In Archery Is a lot lower. They make for a great combo given players can look at the spectrum from Warden to Ranger and pick where they think diminishing returns come.

I have similar arguments for the other suggestions but that one was the clear outliner of what you want.

[Fendi]

Imo it's a long way off. Winter and devs probs have some idea of how they want it anyway.

Dont merge ranger and Warden. Just scrap sentinel, and just add pride to ranger without changing the 2H stats - still better than Eastern Blade but isn't that high damage.

Scrap halb - doesn't even have any class locked halberds.

[DR.]

Imo it's a long way off. Winter and devs probs have some idea of how they want it anyway.

I know. I would have posted this on the Feature Requests for Ni2 but we don't have that thread yet. It's not like I'm hurting anyone by posting this sooner.

They will have some ideas on the topic but this is my take on what to do hence this is a feature requests, not a demanded.

Don't merge ranger and Warden. Just scrap sentinel, and just add pride to ranger without changing the 2H stats - still better than Eastern Blade but isn't that high damage.

Scrap halb - doesn't even have any class locked halberds.

Sentinel has the biggest problems out of all the classes atm but It can be fixed for an NI2. You don't need to scrap classes because most of the people don't like the concept of that hero... You make them Into classes people will like more.

You have given no reasoning for why a 2h hero and an armoured hero for sniper should be joined... They are racially different classes so meeting In the middle would give a lack laster outcome of a less tanky Ranger that can use 2h's a bit better. Who would want that and If so how many people. Compare that if you joined Warden and Ranger. Most people would probably pick a side being full Warden or full Ranger but you can easily see people willing to trade off some bow skill for a bit more armour.       

Classes like Warden and Ranger would be considered generalist. A generalist is considered versatile. Rangers armour "buff" is always with him no matter what and Warden specializes In what people use the most ranged. Classes like Sentry and Senti would be considered a specialist. A class that trades off something that's very important ingame play on that class for better skills in something else. Generalist to specialists is more of a spectrum but we can label classes with titles. 

All 8 classes I suggest have what I would call a good spectrum. The Warden to Ranger is the best example to give how popular Warden is. Given the right stats, Its possible Warden could become more of a glass cannon In NI2 so more fire power for less armour and ranger could become even tanker for less bow skill.


I've suggested classes yes but its more the concept of being able to pick what stats you have. The 16 heroes are nice? but chances are you reading this wanted a class to be different In some wave. This system would do and it's not overly complicated.

[Forward]

0. Whole idea of many armour sets you mix sounds nice but will be aesthetical nightmare so please not.

About classes:

1. One archer class is what I was talking about for a long time. I see no viable hybrid options for ranged DPS class.
2. Just call it 'generic slasher class' and not focus on swords, especially one-handed ones.
3. OK, 'slasher with pike'. If you want it to be distinguished from (2), it might work.
4. Honestly I see no point in NI system when throwing weapons hardly linked with using pikes/polearms. In other mods it's different (at it's a logic in it). Native huscarls using Axe+Shield+Throwing Axes,  PoP Legionaires using Sword+Shield+Throwing Spears (Pila/Hastae/etc). I would prefer to choose secondary weapon or shield rather then using a pike.
5. Generic xbow class. Again, disagree with different armour sets. I think it should be more like current CM, slow shooting with heavy damage and armour piercing. NI Repeaterman rather should be replaced with Archer which is more realistic.
6. I dislike an idea of dedicated shielders, because it leads to non-interactive gameplay. I would rather replace PC shielder with NPC shieldwall which would allow players to focus on killing bots, which is most fun in M&B.
7. As useful as Juggernaut. Don't make same mistake again. Not needed. Generic slasher (2) should have good enough skill to do the same. Call it 'generic fighter' if you want.
8. Makes no sense.
9. I would remove mid-wave healing from the game completely. Medic only to bring tomes, secondary class as in NI.
10. Secondary class, like in NI.

[DR.]

0. It's just as feasible as it was for Ni. You don't need to add everything I've suggested at once.

1. Well ye

2. This is a hybrid ranged class technically.

3. Given how much I play mara I've talk many times to many people I would be wiling to trade in some or all of my throwing skill for other things that help in melee. This new class would allow me to get shield skill. I'm sure I'm not the only one that would take this deal as well.

4. I didn't even say it would get polearm. It could but that's looking to far in the future. The aim of this was to get the concept down not the small things like that.

5. This was the class I'm most on the fence about. I think it would be interesting to be more of a tank with an xbow but it would also be fun to say the opposite. A faster less tanky xbow would be interesting.

6,7,8 Talking about meta is not for this topic. It's related but I feel like they could be a completely different topic but given I do have thoughts on the subject I'll post them at some point. My idea would give a bigger reason for why people would want to play classes like this.

9. This is more referencing one of the last requests about making classes into medics. https://forum.nordinvasion.com/showthread.php?tid=73727

10. I wouldn't make it you need to depended on this class but in my mind it would be comparables to class 8 and 6.

[Malong]

What if, instead of having classes altogether, you just get stat and skill points as you level and you get to allocate them as you wish? And then items have required stats and/or skills to equip? Then you would have more freedom and custom "classes" even if cookie cutter templates emerge as the most competitive.

[DR.]

What if, instead of having classes altogether, you just get stat and skill points as you level and you get to allocate them as you wish? And then items have required stats and/or skills to equip? Then you would have more freedom and custom "classes" even if cookie cutter templates emerge as the most competitive.

I did suggest something for ni quite some time ago like this. Think it was a pm to a Dev so I'll find it later when I'm on my PC.

The main problem I remember it would be alot harder to balance given so many possibilities. You also have other problems just to simplify put everything gets a bit more complicated for new people. The system we have now is very intuitive. Mine is more complicated for everyone now given we're not used to it but should be ok given heroes still can have names to them.

I do I like your idea more but I think it has problems In a PvP/PvE mod unless given some heavy limitations and then at that point why not do it my way or the old way.

[Forward]

Agree, non-class system would be better except harder to balance. And some current classes might not find their place in the non-class meta, like crossbowmen might be outclassed by bowmen and such.